The 2012 high school season in the nation’s No. 1 hotbed for lacrosse, the New York/New Jersey/Connecticut tristate region, is now one for the books.
With the season now complete, take a moment to weigh in with your vote in our latest poll, which asks, “Who do you think was the MVP of the 2012 boys lax season in the tristate area?”
To vote, go to the right panel of this page. Then, scroll past the “New Comments” and “Popular” tabs and click on “Poll.” You will then see the poll questions and can cast your vote from the multiples choices, or, write in your choice if it’s not one of the choices.
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Posted In: You make the call
Matheis was last year’s MSG Varsity MVP as a junior, is the ESPNHS #1 Player in the country, is Connecticut’s first-ever 3X AA, is Darien’s all-time leading scorer with 355 pts in 4 seasons, 107 more than the previous record held by Cooper MacDonnell, and had his best year ever this season with 122 pts, 11 more than Darien’s previous single season scoring record! He led this year’s Darien team to a 20-2 record, including wins over St. Anthony’s, Manhasset, Torre Pines, and 2 over New Canaan, a #9 national LaxPower rating, and a CT M State Championship.
Sorry LaxLessonsFan:
Matheis may be good but against Yorktown this year he was basically shut down. Can’t say the same for Devin Dwyer from Garden City. Dwyer is the MVP going away.
That was one game, and he had (1,3), which is still good. It was also his second worst offensive output of the season (not including the State championship, when he was taken out of the game early with an injury). He did much, MUCH better than Dwyer did against Duvnjak; (3,4) vs (0,0). It’s easy to rack up a lost of assists with finishers like Guterding and Kennedy, and sharpshooters like Berkery and Savage; put Dwyer on a different team, without automatic finishers and those numbers drop. Obviously, he is still the best feeder in the country, but I think Case could have made most of the assists that Dwyer made; not all, but most. Dwyer, on the other hand, probably couldn’t have scored half the goals that Case did.
This says it all. Dwyer requires being surrounded by great players to be effective. Matheis is great regardless of who surrounds him. Case has produced amazing results the last couple of years without one D1 recruit on attack with him!
Long Island:
Tie – Devin Dewer – GC and Bobby Duvnjak – Sett
Westcheser/Rockland:
Conner Gately – Town
New Jersey:
Will Reynolds – Delbarton
CT.:
Case Matheis – Darien
westchester4321, Matheis had 1g and 4a against Yorktown. How did Dwyer do against Duvnjak and Manhasset? Matheis was 3g and 4a against Dunjak.
Dwyer hands down. Best player on best team in nation. Led to NYS title. All time leading scorer at GC as well. Amazing career.
Case is fantastic, no doubt, but Dwyer was better. Made his team better in every game.
Case would have had to lead Darien to FCIAC and State title and go undefeated to be in the discussion. I dont even think this is a discussion. One could bring up Marino but I would say Dwyer was more responsible. There were times in big games, where he controlled everything.
As a non GC fan, I respectfully am very glad to see him go to college.
This is an individual award not a team award. Dwyer had a better team around him; Guterding, Kennedy, Savage, Berkery, George, etc… Case had West and Lindley. If going for (1,3) in a game is considered Case being shut down, then that is just more proof that Case is #1. He had 7 points against Duvy…how many did Dwyer have again? Also, Case won it last year, and this year he had 35 more points…
Dwyer vs. Matheis reminds me a lot of Stanwick vs. Pannell..
Dwyer is a better overall quarterback and feeder but Matheis is much more dynamic and can score on his own better while still being able to dish the rock quite efficiently.
In comparison one needs to take into account how much better GC’s supporting cast was than Darien’s. While Darien had its fair share of offensive talent, Case played on an attack line with an uncommitted junior and an uncommitted sophomore. Dwyer on the other hand had Justin Guterding a Duke commit and MSG Varsity 2nd Team All Tri-State player, and Liam Kennedy who was an Underclass All American (not sure about college). The strength of Dwyer’s supporting cast was extremely evident went he went 0g,0a against Manhasset but his team still won 9-3. Garden City was able to score 9 goals without the help of Dwyer. Darien on the other hand won the game 10-7 against Manhasset and Matheis put up 3g, 4a. That shows how heavily Darien relied on Matheis and the attention he received. Dwyer probably had much less of a microscope on him because of the strength of his fellow attackman relative to Case.
I think that Case Matheis is a better, more skilled lacrosse player than Devin Dwyer. HOWEVER, the fact that Dwyer won the the NY state title and led his team to an undefeated season makes him very hard to pick against for Tristate POY.
Still not sure who I would choose but that is just my two cents.
You put Matheis on GC and that team would beat some good D1 college teams. Can’t wait to see him at Duke with Jordan Wolf and others.
Bottom-line for me, has anyone ever come close to scoring 7 pts on Duvy?!! Even with GC’s talent, I can’t imagine Dwyer ever getting close, particulary given Bobby blanked Dwyer this year. Matheis actually did rack up 7 pts against Duvy….and with far less talent around him than Dwyer.
Matheis is Mikey Powell and Rob Panell rapped in one player. He has my vote!
GC beats some good D1 teams now
Then GC would beat more D1 teams with Matheis.
Dwyer has always been a #7-#10 ranked player in the country. Matheis has always been a #1-#2. Dwyer just happened to play on a team with many more legit D1 players at GC than Matheis at Darien. Matheis is still the stronger player, as he always has been, and he would much more sorely missed if out of action.
MVP = Best player on the best team. Dwyer wins it hands down, GC won all the big games and finished #1 in the nation with a state title.
In addition he had 110 points, a few less than Case but still a ton. In the Sett game GC was willing to let Dwyer be locked off because they knew that the 5 on 5 they were left with was an easy way to get a win. Dwyer took one for the team and GC won – isn’t that what the name of the game is? Wins?
As far as Case being Pannell and Powell rolled into one… slow down. Case is a very good player and I’m sure he’ll be a hell of a player at Duke but ask Jordan Wolf how hard it is to navigate the ACC. Wait till Case see’s Goran Murray, then tell me he’s better than Powell and Pannell.
MVP most certainly does NOT mean best player on the best team. It is the best player/most valuable player. It’s an individual award, not a team award. The team with the best player isn’t always the best team. And Goran Murray matches up well with Matheis and Wolf. I think he would shut down Powell too; his strengths are just perfectly suited to shut down small speedsters. Pannell is a more physical presence, and thus a very different player from Matheis, so those comparisons must be toned down.
Do you really think GC would be willing to let Dwyer be “locked off” if they thought he had the capacity to generate 7 pts against Duvy?! Don’t think so in a game where GC scored 9 goals.
If Matheis played on GC, they would look to exploit his match-up with Duvy, particularly because there are so many other good players on GC that would make it harder to double and triple team him, which is typically the case in all his games with Darien.
Matheis is simply the stronger player and more valuable to his team. Dwyer is a very good player that has benefited from being on a great team. He could go down and GC would still be very tough to beat. Not so with Matheis and Darien. We will see the opposite in college. Matheis will benefit from being on the stronger team at Duke as compared to Dwyer at Harvard.
Any goalies out there that consistently stood on their heads alot keeping their team in close games vs tough/better comp or helped win them. Same for someone on offense? Maybe that’s the MVP vs albeit great kids that are already on stacked teams. But as for Dwyer vs Math. Does GC notably lose games w/o Dwyer? Prob not. Is Dar more likely to lose games w/o Math–probably so. So maybe he’s more MVPish then Dwyer? Just saying…….. Without a certain kid on a team, is the team fundamentally different in a weaker way??
Slacrosse,
I agree 100% about both your Dwyer and Matheis observations, well said.
In terms of goalies, I think Tom Branca is the one goalie who really deserves credit for keeping his team in every game. His statistics are impressive, allowing just 106 goals out of 310 shots for a 66.5% save percentage. He also stepped up in big games the entire season, most notably against Manhasset, Massapequa, Ridgefield, New Canaan, Yorktown (twice), Somers, Lakeland and Mahopac. In fact during the playoffs, Branca made 43 saves on 56 shots, that is exceptionally impressive. Granted he had a great defense, but the better teams in JJ’s schedule were able to penetrate the middle of that zone and take shots on the crease, and he was able to still hold JJ, who had a low scoring offensive unit this season, in games and make every single one competitive.
I’m sorry but Branca… Best player in the tri state needs to play well every game Branca gave up 12 goals in 3 quarters to IONA PREP before getting pulled. Sorry he’s not even close
Why didn’t Branca get AA in Section 1?
I think it should also be noted – Mathies went out in the state championship game after a hip injury from a TRIPLE team – opponents can do that against him, unlike Dwyer who plays on a team with too many D1 scoring threats to ever allow a triple team. Case fought to get back in the game, the NC D-man pounds his hip and he exits again, his HS career seems over. NC rallies to 7 – 4, and the momentum is theirs, Darien’s O is stalled without their QB. Darien gets an EMO and suddenly #4 is back on the field limping, from the 20 yard line he fires a bullet, spot-on pass to Lindley in front of the cage who sinks it. Many have described it as the game-changer, the spark the Wave needed to finish what they started. That was his 355th point and the last in his storied HS career- pretty special, and worth noting in discussions about what makes an MVP
Laxumus/The Wave,
Not gonna pick between Branca and Matheis but both of your descriptions of how these kids “made a real difference” sounds like the guts of what I “feel” makes up an MVP type kid.
If we are talking about MVP as in who is the best player in the Tri-State area that’s not easy to do because they don’t play in the same league. The names brought up a very worthy Dwyer, Case, Bobby D and others.
If we are talking who is the most valuable to his team my pick is Gately a better feeder than Case and right with Dwyer and maybe the edge to Connor based on who he’s feeding. 116 total points 37g 79a, anyway all great and many more that most of us have not seen play. Can’t wait for 2013!!
Agree completely. When own played a higher ranked Darien team, Gately was by far the best player on the field. Not Mathies, In fact Methies was a non factor and Town didn’t even shut him off. When own played GC, Gately and Dwyer was a wash and Dwyer is surrounded by the best personnel in the country. MVP has o be Gately, them Dwyer #2. I would put Crey ahead of Matheis be no way New Canaan wins FCIAC without him in goal. Then Branca because JJ is barely 500 team without him. Mathies should be among 10 other guys in the discussion after those guys for sure. Not sure how he will do at Duke but he had a HS career to be proud of.
Again, you are going off of one game again. Also, your comparison is pure fallacy; Gately AKA “best player on the field” and Matheis AKA “non-factor” had the same amount of points (1,3); in fact, all but one of Gately’s points came on the man up too.
If you watch tapes of the Yorktown game, Matheis cleanly dusted his defender several times scoring (but barely stepping in the crease once), hitting the cross bar and post two other times, and just missing the upper corner another time. Noone stopped him, he simply missed several shots he normally makes….and was still (1,3) or (1,4)!
laxr iust to set the record straight Gately had 5 assists in that game, 2 were EMO, and more importantly with less than 5 min. left in game score was 11- 6 Darien scored 2 goals in the last min. to make the score 11- 9, as far as who is the MVP Case and Dwyer are both great players and are clearly the two best players in the tristate, too close to call, but as sect 1 says many more great players around that many of us have not seen play or get the pr that the kids from traditional programs get
Laxr,
I know your not addressing this to me, Gately just to set the record straight had 5 point all assist in that game.
As for who had the better HS career it’s Case, he played more games than Gately who was brought up at the very end of his Fr yr. As great a player Case is I still believe without Connor it would hurt Town more, I would like to be able to compare them in College but it’s going to be difficult with Connor going to a start up program.
Maybe I was a point off, but the fact remains, 5 pts vs. 4 pts…not exactly player of the game vs. non-factor.
laxr… I’m pretty sure Case had 1 goal and 1 assist for a total of only 2pts not 4pts like you said maybe I’m wrong but I think not.. MSG has the stats and the times of all the goals etc. check them out at the end of their article about the game, thats not today Case was a non-factor just not his best game
Who will be best player next year.
Ward Melville middie Jack Bruckner (Duke).
Laxr,
I Agee the one point is nothing, not sure if others pointing to that game were there?
If they were I can see how they felt Case was not as much a factor as Connor, because for 3 1/2 quarters it was not a game until penalties put Darien in a position to run off 4 goals. Lastly it was a pleasure to watch Case play the last 4 yrs one of the best ever to play in the CT/NY area.
It’s true the game was not as close as the score would suggest, but to say that penalties put Darien in a position to make a run is somewhat unfair given that Yorktown benefited from a string of EMOs as well.
Tristate player of year in order:
1. Dwyer – best player on best team
2. Gately – best player overall
3. Brophy – Led FP to state title, beating Ridgefield, team that beat Darien in FCIACs. Named CT Player of Year by coaches
4. Carey – Sngle handily responsible for 5-6 NC wins, including vs Field for FCIAC title
5. Mathias – Belongs in discussion for body of work over 4 years though if just analyzing this year would be in Top 10 players in tristate but not Top 5
This is the worst list (and worst reasoning I’ve ever seen).
1. Best player on best team isn’t what MVP means. Dwyer is still great though; one of two players worthy of MVP honors.
2. I don’t mean to slight Gately because he is a good player, but he is absolutely NOT the best player overall. He would barely make my top 10 attackmen in the region, let alone top 5 players.
3. FP beat the FCIAC runner ups who beat Darien (by one, and got beat badly by Darien during the season), Darien beat the FCIAC champions, who beat Ridgefield twice when Wilkinson was healthy. Poor rationale.
4. Carey was great. He did not win NC the FCIAC title game thoug – that was an average game for him; Blasco won it.
5. Matheis had his best year ever, leading the Tri-State in points, putting up 7 points in his matchup with Duvnjak, being held below 4 points ONCE all year (3 points against Wilton; this is also not including the injured game). Not top 5? Are you for real?
Gately was a first team tristate selection by Paul Carcaterra and one of his top 3 before the season too. He had better numbers than Mathias and Yorktown beat Darien.
As for Mathias sr year it was a very good one for sure, but Connecticut coaches picked Brophy as the player of the year. I suspect Carey was a close second.
He was a first team tri-state selection, but I would disagree with it; I don’t have to agree with Carc on everything. He didn’t have better #s than Matheis; Case had about a dozen more points if memory serves me correctly, and he had much more balance. Case can feed, but he can also break down a defense (something Gately isn’t as good at doing). Yorktown beat Darien. So what? Assuming that Yorktown was a better team than Darien (I’ll get to this), that’s a team feat, not and individual one. And people take one game and make a season out of it; outside of the Darien win, Yorktown’s resume is painfully thin. They could blown off the field by Chaminade, GC, and Smithtown West. They lost to St. Anthony’s and Wilton (Darien beat both of these teams. Darien beat Wilton twice; the second time, they won 13-4, less than two weeks after Wilton beat Yorktown). Darien’s overall season is superior enough to overrule the head to head (and before you attack me for that, ask yourself; do you think Wilton is better than Yorktown? If the answer is no, then you agree with my reasoning and my point stands. If you say yes, then by that reasoning Darien is better than Wilton, and you have an A>B>C>A scenario. And not one person in CT thinks the CT player of the year award holds any meaning anymore after this year’s choice.
Laxtime, what were Brophy’s numbers this year?
Matheis had the best year of his legendary career this season. He scored 122 pts, 11 more than the previous best in Darien history. Given Darien has produced 10 CT POY since its inception, that is significant.
Brophy isn’t even the best middie in CT, Henry West is. In fact, there are at least several other players in CT stronger than Brophy. In addition to Matheis and West, there is at least Britton, Wilkensen, Eppley, and Carey. In fact, I would pick Darien Middie, Bobby Weaver over Brophy.
Tristate-
Case – Best overall HS career any region has seen in a while, arguable most dynamic HS player to play the game. We take what he does for granted because how often he has done it, with that being said I don’t think he was the MVP of the tristate, West could have arguable been the MVP of the Darien team. Yes, Case had his best stats season this year, but even so doesn’t guarantee him the MVP, he would get easy Assists by working it around and letting West rip it from 20. Case will be a stud in college, everyone who doubts him because of his size is unaware of how truly talented he is. Take Case away from his team, Darien would still be very good and could have done what it did, no doubt with more of a challenge though. I’m sure Duke coaches are more than anxious to have Case be there guy, and he will be a immediate impact player in a tough ACC conference.
Dwyer – Great system player, had the fortune to play on a great program for 4 years, with studs to his left and right. He is a wonderful player who has a lot of talent, but he had the fortune of playing on such balanced teams, he wouldn’t have had the year he had if he didn’t have two great off ball attack men in Kennedy and Gutterding. Will go down as one of best to play and lead his team, a very stacked talented team, to a state championship. But any QB type player in Dwyers position, they’d be very good too. Yes he had very good #’s, but again the team he had helps tremendously. Take Dwyer away from GC, they still win states, GC had a fantastic team, any bench player may have started anywhere else in the Tri-State area. Dwyer will also be the QB type in college for a very lucky Harvard team.
Gately – If we are going MVP by Most Valuable Player to their team, has to be this kid. 35 g’s and 79 a’s playing against arguable the toughest schedule in the Tri-State. Didn’t have the team Dwyer had and still put up more overall production. Doesn’t do things as flashy as Case but he still gets the job done. Jumped on the scene late, unlike Case and Dwyer who emerged early, Gately’s coming out party was his junior year, those of you who were at the state semi’s game his junior year would agree he was hands down best player on that field against a very good GC team. Take Gately out of Yorktown team, Town doesn’t make it past Section Championship. College wise, has the ability to be the best out of all 3, most would agree he has the most upside. His potential hasn’t been reached yet, hopefully we will see it in college. Marquette got quite the steal in Gately.
Either way, can’t go wrong with these 3 guys. Any coach in the country would take them on their teams. All of them are great pieces to build/place in a team. Best of luck to them in college.
Dwyer and Gately had far more legit D1 options on offense than Matheis. Matheis has not had one D1 recruit playing with him on attack over the last couple of years, yet he still produced incredible numbers. Last year’s attack line had one guy who is not even playing in college and one guy playing D3 2nd string. This year, he had a junior and sophomore that are uncommitted.
With all due respect to Yorktown’s schedule, it isn’t nearly the toughest schedule in the tri-state. They do as much as they can, and put together one of the most ambitious non-conferences schedules in the country, but there are so many cupcakes in Section 1 (everyone but John Jay this year) that players can inflate their stats against. He just simply isn’t as good as the other two (and I think Moore, Schultz, Rotanz, Wilkinson, McDonough were all better too). And I don’t see how he has the most upside of the 3. I think he’s the least athletic of the 3. One could make the argument that he has equal upside to Dwyer, but I think Dwyer has quicker decision making/release and he can misdirect the defense like nobody else can. Matheis has the most upside simply because he can create for himself, which Dwyer and Gately don’t do with nearly as much regularity. I believe Mariano will be a better player than Gately in college.
Mr Accurate,
What we are all talking about is this yr only, Case had plenty of ops this yr West, Weaver,Linley ect. It’s all just our opinions anyway. They are all outstanding players.
Weaver only played the first half of the season, Lindley played only the second half. That’s two other options: West and Weaver/Lindley.
Laxr,
You have the right to your opinion, you just named 5 players plus Case so that’s 6, then you back hand Dwyer by saying you think that your more inclined to compare him to Dwyer.
Which means you have those 6 ahead of him also, nobody is going to agree with that, Case played 4 yrs except for missing some games do to injury, Gately took over the O his Jr yr and still has more Assits then Case in his HS career,
you are right Sec 1 was down this yr from others. You are right Case is the better finisher but Gately is the better creator.
1. Didn’t mean to backhand Dwyer. He has similar skills to Gately, but I think he’s better at them.
2. Gately has more assists than Case (I’ll take your word on this), but Case has far more goals. Gately is a better feeder, but Case is a better finisher AND creator; he can create his own offense and he can create for others, whereas Gately can’t break down a defense. (I guess we just have different definitions of creating).
3. I think there are people who would take the 6 I listed (Matheis, Dwyer, Schultz, McDonogh, Moore, Rotanz, Wilkinson) over Gately.
Just watch this…Matheis’ Junior highlight reel. Listen to Paul Carcaterra, Section 1, Yorktown, Syracuse legend, and ESPN & MSG lacrosse expert describe Matheis’ game….”He reminds me of the 4-Time first team All American Mikey Powell”….hardly a desription for a finisher.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7bv30YsVx1w
Also watch Matheis breakdown top defenders like St. Anthony’s and now UVA’s Danseglio….he does things Dwyer and Gately wish were part of their arsenal.
Awesome dude but that’s last year. We’re talking about this year. HELLOOO
Gotta go wit Dwyer and Gately 1a and 1b. Flip a coin.
Let’s keep the discussion to this year. This isn’t an overall varsity career award. It’s player for this year, a year in which Case was held to one goal by both Yorktown and New Canaan.
Curious that you would present Case’s one goal against NC as a poor performance. He was injured 15 minutes into the game, and still managed to have a resounding impact by turning the tide back in Darien’s favor in the 4th an EMO assist. And sure you could just look at the goal against Yorktown. Or, you could also recognize that he had 3 assists as well. For any other player in the country, 1 goals and 3 assists is an average performance at worst. For Matheis, it was his worst game of the season. If that isn’t a rousing endorsement in his favor, I don’t know what is.
The video makes very clear Matheis is the best creator of any discussed.
In 2012, Matheis generated 122 points, more offense than any on this list. Matheis also had 5 goals against NC in their first game, he had 1 goal before going out with an injury in the 1st qtr of the state final. He then came in during the 4th qtr to get a criticl assist in the 4th qtr to put the game out of reach.
Gately only had one goal against Darien.
This is from last year before Case tore his ACL. Not to say he didn’t come back and have a good year but we’re talkin bout this year.
He was SIGNIFICANTLY better this year.
After reading all the comments, here are my rankings…
Tristate player of year
1. Gately
2. Dwyer
3 (tie) Brophy
3 (tie) Carey
I don’t have a dog in this fight, but if the Conn. coaches voted Brophy as POY and Gately universally acknowledged as Section One POY I would say it’s between them for sure. Further, Gately and Town beat Matheise and Darien and in the Town game Case was held to 1-0 before having a few late assists on EMOs with time winding down after Yorktown had built a comfortable lead.
No matter how you try to discredit it, Case had 1 goal and 3 assists. What is absolutely absurd is that people are trying to make this award come down to one game that their TEAMS played against each other. Sure, Darien and Case had their worst game of the year against Yorktown, but why must we ignore every other game of the year? How about the games against Manhasset, St. Anthony’s, Torey Pines, Ridgefield, etc…It is absolute nonsense to turn the MVP award into a comparison between two attackman in ONE GAME in which their TEAMS played each other…pure nonsense.
Laxr relax take a deep breath, all the kids mentioned are good players everyone is entitled to their opinion as to what an MVP is. I agree it shouldn’t come down to one game between 2 players. However In your earlier blogs you and others almost scoffed at EMO assists, also had the wrong numbers and which team had more EMO goals during the game, a goal is goal and an assist is an assist, regardless which team it is. I don’t think anyone is trying to discredit Case, the kid is great, he didn’t have his best game that day but he is still great, it happens KIDS don’t always play up to our expectations. So you can go with Case, and others can go with Gately or Dwyer or anyone else they want and we can all talked about who played better competition etc. IT IS JUST A GAME played by KIDS who seem to enjoy doing it maybe the parents and adults should CHILL a little!!
I must concede to a very well written post. You are correct.
P.S. I wasn’t so much scoffing at the EMO assists; I wouldn’t have even mentioned it if not for the fact that after the game people scoffed at Case’s late points in a similar manner. It just seemed that the performances weren’t as different as some have claimed.
After reading all of these posts, the only two serious candidates are:
(1) Matheis
(2) Dwyer
Gately is a fine player, made significant impact this year, but is not quite at the same level as the first two. Brophy isn’t even one of the top 5 in CT. He is a complete fabrication by his FP coach and should be out of consideration. He probably only generated about 50 pts this year. Henry West is a far better middie than Brophy. Tom Carey is an excellent goalie, a fine young man, and a stronger player than Brophy but is also not quite this level.
Between Matheis and Dwyer, it comes down to do you give the award to the best player who played on a very good team or do you give it to a very strong player who played on the best team? Because, in the absolute, Darien was a top 10 national power (#9 LaxPower) and Matheis is the best player, I lean that direction. While I hate to go against anyone from LI, this is probably the right thing to do
ACC10 You are mistaken Gately had 0 goals in this years Darien game BUT he did have 5 asisits 2 of them EMO the others were 6 on 6 that shouldn’t matter but there are some who don’t seem to feel its as good whether its EMO or not someone has to find the open man and then he has to put it in the net either way its 1g and 1a
The EMO assists have about as much bearing as Case’s late assists; they offset. In all honesty neither carried their teams in that game; Mariano, and Fusco in particular were instrumental for Yorktown, and West had 4 goals for Darien.
Actually the whole Town offense vs Darien ran through Gately. All his assists were during the period when the game was decided, most in the first half. He controlled the game. Conversely Matheis barely had the ball in his stick till the outcome was decided. Without Gately, Town loses this game by 4-5 goals.
Laxr, etc. if the CT coaches named Brophy POY shouldn’t this discussion be comparing Brophy, not Mathias, to credentials of LI POW Dwyer and Hudson Valley POW Gately for overall tristate MVP unless NJ had a POW that should also be included?
You should check out Laxpower Forums; not one person on the CT boards agrees with the decision.
No thanks. Laxpower forum is a bitter old men’s club. I don’t know anyone who has read their forums in the last 5-6 years
haha. Fair enough.
Laxr,
Case 157 career Assists, Goals 198
Gately 162 Goals. 70
Case great player
Dwyer same
I enjoy the conversation, fun stuff
I like Rotanz does everything well
Moore nice player a little slow footed a shooter mostly.
Wilkinson nice player but no Gately
Schultz now there is a player I like
Sean McDonough very gd 64 points, I’ll take Gatley
Moore is 6ft4 220…..he’s allowed to be a “little slow footed”
Tristate MVP…
1 – Dwyer 2- Gaitly 3. Carey 4. Mathius
I read all of the posts and studied whatever stats were available. After considering the whole body of work, it has to be (1) Matheis and (2) Dwyer. They are simply a cut above.
Definitely a two horse race this year. Dwyer and Gately are equally talented. Dwyer had better overall talent surrounding him, yet Gately produced equally effectively, so Gately gets the nod. Had Matheis performed better vs. Yorkown and in state finals, he would have been in the mix. So instead I have Carey from New Canaan behind Dwyer and Gately.
1. Case was injured in the state finals. All things considered, he had a great game.
2. It is still nonsense to eliminate Matheis based on ONE game (in which he had 4 points no less). Nevermind that he dominated better teams than Yorktown, and is the only player to get the better of Duvnjak over the course of a game (let alone score 7 points). There are arguments to be made for Gately; him scoring one more point than Case did when their teams played is not one of them.
Agree, you don’t go by 1 game but if you do I think its fair to say its a wash and maybe slight edge to Gately considering his team won and he was covered by the All Ameican #10 who seemed to be a little behind most of the game. Why do you keep bringing up his performance against Bobby D and Manhasset if you don”t want to JUDGE someone for one game?? How many kids have played G.C. the last 2years , taken 7 shots and have 5 goals, against who many think is the best Goalie in the country. Gately did and had 1 assist to go along with it Does that make him MVP? NO it doesn’t The MVP for this year deserves to go to Dwyer Case a close #2 with many others in the mix.
1. I agree that within that game, Gately had the edge.
2. The reason that I brought up the performance vs Duvnjak, even though it was one game, was that it was a direct matchup; comparing Gately and Matheis in a head-to-head game is meaningless because they are not going head-to-head directly. You are right though; Manhasset was just one game. Matheis had much more than just one good game though.
The stat someone mentioned that Gately has had more assists in 2 seasons than Mathise has had in 4 seasons is unreal, especially since Town plays a tougher schedule. So it should be either Gately, best player overall in tri state, or Dwyer, best player on best team in the country. Guess it depends ow you defend MVP.
Did Gately not play at all sophomore year? Regardless, he still had less than half as many goals as Matheis (also, since we are talking about this year, Case had more points than Gately).
FYI Didn’t play until 6 or 7 th game at all. Then split time with Mariano as 3rd attack, Had a few seniors ahead of them, Mariano, very good player should be AA next year going to U MASS. Don’t know first hand but from the rumors etc. that year had too much politics involved with team and players seemed to selfish etc. but you always here that crap when good programs have so-so years, finger pointing etc
Some other stats to consider:
Gately had 0 goals against Darien.
Matheis scored 3X as many goals in his career at Gately, yes 3X!
Matheis had +53% more pts than Gately in his career
Matheis led his team to 3 State Championships
Dwyer led his team to 1 State Championship and 2 Finals
Gately never made it past the Semi-Finals
Funny, I thought the question was who was the MVP this year, not the career in H.S. No one had a better career than Case hands down. As far as this year Case had a great year but so did a lot of other kids who weren’t even mentioned. Do you really think the FCIAC or the CT> state champ. is equal to winning NYS champ? The amount of quality teams in N.Y> dwarfs CT. just a fact
So lets talk about this year.
Case led his team to 20-2 record. Gately and Yorktown were 16-5
Case and Darien were #9 in LaxPower and #13 on IL final national rankings
Gately and YT were #27 in LP and unranked on IL
Matheis generated 122 points this season and Gately about 110
Matheis puts up 7 pts on the #1 defenseman in the country, Dwyer is held to 0 pts by the same defender, Duvnjak
Case leads his team to its 3rd State Title in 4 years, Gately and YT get through the relatively weak Section 1 to get to the State Semi-Finals where their season ends
Again , the question was THIS Year!! For H.S. career its Case hands down For the record Gately had 116 its And when G.C. had the 3 AA on D last year along with Marino in goal he got the better of them ask anyone who was at that game or saw tapes of it Gately was the best player on the fiels that day !! But we are talking about THIS YEAR, So the MVP should go to DWYER with Case a very close #2 and any # of players 3rd and so on down the line
Big fan of Case, but doesn’t the fact his team won the state championship WITHOUT him in the line-up for the most part, prevent him from the being the most VALUABLE player on his team? Player of the year – probably should have been – best offensive talent – possibly.
regarding Gately, similar view – ‘town depth works against him. Take him off the squad, which game besides Darien or JJ or the MD squad do they lose which they won? Do they still win Sec 1 and lose to GC?
Purely MOST VALUABLE – look at players on teams that would have had (or did) drastically lowered team performance without them. Duvnjak on Sett, Branca on JJ, Conley on Mam’k, – i’m sure there are many others in Secs 8 & 10.
Discussion confusing most impressive Offensive player this season with Most VALUABLE unless we just assume value in lax is all about individual offense performance on the best teams…
X marks the spot –
Darien won because they had built a 7-2 lead before Case was taken out of the lineup (just 15 minutes into the game). As soon as Case left the field, the Darien offense went on a 20 minute scoring drought, which let New Canaan claw back to a 7-4 deficit in the 4th quarter. The drought ended when Case limped back onto the field and assisted on an EMO goal, returning momentum back to Darien. Not only could Darien have lost if Case had not played at all in the game (meaning no 7-2 lead to hold onto), but they might still have lost if Case didn’t return on the EMO to steal back momentum.
Conor Gately.
I vote for Conner Gately
Gately hands down.
Case: The engine for Darien. Returns to state final after hip pointer and feeds Lindley for the momentum changer in the 4th. 69 g 59 a !
Robo – 100 percent. Another BIG factor – no pun intended – is size and strength. Moore obviously has both. Guys like Dwyer and Gately have very good size and will develop the strength to go with it at the next level.
Hank,
Let get Case total points right, he had 122 total 6 more than Gately.
It’s hard to say anything neg about Case he is Great, but we are in a debate here.
My opinion of who is the MVP, I have said from the start that Gately is more important to his team than Case and I standby that. There have been many things added about career and Championships, but this is about 2012.
Darien did not win the F. C. I. A. C which means they did not win the county Championship and did not even make the Finals. In NY there season would be over, but because of the way CT system works they are given another chance and made the most of it. In CT was Case the POY-No Brophy, was he the MVP of his own team- No Britton was, was he the MVP of the State Championship game No West was. With that said I don’t see how he can be Tri State MVP
Sec1,
State Championships matter most in CT. Darien beat the FCIAC Champions (NC) handly twice this year 13-3 (regular season) and 11-5 (state finals).
Case won 2 of 3 CT POY awarded this year, the Officials award and MSG Varsity’s. The Officials only give its award in years when they feel there are truly exceptional players. The only other two years it was awarded was to CJ Constabile and Matt White. CT coaches typcially give their award to the MVP of the CT “Team of the Year”. Fairfield Prep was named CT Team of the year this year despite its #69 LaxPower rating as compared to Darien’s #9.
Darien’s Eric Parnon was awarded Darien’s Team MVP last year when Case was the CT Coaches POY, MSG Varsity’s CT POY, MSG Varsity’s Tri-State POY, and ESPNHS’ #1 player in the country. Why should this year be any different? Tony Britton had an outstanding year and deserves recognition for what he did with a young and inexperienced defense. Henry West also had a tremendous state final, particularly after Case went out with an injury. All the accolades make great sense.
With all this said, Case was clearly the POY in the state of CT, in the Tri-State, and possibley beyond. The responses to this blog confirm this.
Seems like the comments favor Gately in a close race over Dwyer. Have to say I agree.
Just to wrap up this discussion, and it was an interesting one, I think any one of three players could be justified – Gately, Dwyer and Carey. The passion of the Darien loyalists is to be admired, but truth be told, Darien’s “bonus” second season came down to one game – vs. New Canaan – and Case was had one goal and one assist, and his team won with him on the bench for half of the game. Sorry but that’s not an MVP.
The point that the Blue Wave would not have even been in a state final if they were in almost any other state is a great one. So really, Darien’s season ended with the upset loss to Ridgefield in which Case was held scoreless in the first half.
So either way Darien has no MVP because either their season should have ended in the FCIAC semis or, even if you count the “bonus” state tournament, Case was not a contributor in the one game that was competitive. Having said that, he had a great career, although the last two years did not end well for him individually, or really for the team, unless you count the “bonus” state tournament win this year as salvaging the disappointment of losses to Yorktown and Ridgefield.
MVP – Gately. Runnerup – Dwyer. 2nd runnerup – Carey (for NC unlikely run to the true title of FCIAC champs).
Regarding your first paragraph, see my response to X marks the spot. Case was injured after 15 minutes of play and left the game. The offense dropped off a cliff without him, and didn’t score again until Case returned for an EMO assist in the 4th quarter. Without Case, Darien might have choked away the game having never regained momentum, and they certainly never would have built the early 7-2 lead that kept NC at arm’s reach when Darien’s offense collapsed.
As for the CT playoffs system, it is what it is. I agree that is not an ideal system, but if you made it all about states, then you wouldn’t be able to have an FCIAC tournament, which essentially amounts to a TOC in CT (minus Fairfield Prep). But alas, it is there, and the season continued; to ignore the state playoffs as if they didn’t happen is just silly. New Canaan won the better title, but Darien won both times the teams met, and neither game was close. You also seem to ignore portions of games when it doesn’t suit your argument, such as the FCIAC loss to Ridgefield; you mention only the first half, when Ridgefield was dominating, but not the second half when Darien made a huge comeback (sparked by Case’s 5 second half points). P.S. You discredit Darien in 2012 for winning states and not FCIACs, but you imply that 2011 ended poorly when by your own reasoning, they would have been champions after winning FCIACs and eliminating Wilton before Case’s injury.
Laxr – love the passion but that CT title game was all Henry West. Case was not dominant before the injury and the one ‘miracle’ assist does not make up for the fact West was the MVP of that game.
More impressed with the game v. Sett when he was against Duvnjak. Was there and see that as the most offensive impressive performance against the best close D pole in the Tri-state area IMO.
Again – the debate is misguided as everyone is focusing on total points and comparative game performance, but missing the reality that all three teams had plenty of depth and talent, so MVP is not the right award to be discussing. BEST OFFENSIVE TALENT or BEST TRI-STATE ATTACKMAN seems to be the focus of this debate.
In that debate, Case wins hands down.
You are right; that was Henry West’s game. But Case’s injury did have an impact, and I’m sure if he had played a full game instead of just a 1/3 of the game, he would have had more than two points.
You make a great point in the last paragraph. If this about who is most important to their team, this debate gets much more open ended, because there are a lot of guys from weaker teams that do all of the heavy lifting. For me, it goes this way:
Best player: Case Matheis (A, Darien/Duke)
Most Valuable Player: Jake Froccaro (M, Port Washington/Princeton)
Actually I kind of like the Connecticut “everyone gets a ribbon” approach. I mean, if NY had it, John Jay would have made the “state tournament” after losing to Yorktown in overtime in the sectional final. 😉
Now that this discussion has ended (congrats Conor or Devin, depending on who you think pulled it out in a close 1-2 race), let’s look toward next season’s preseason MVP. I nominate Jack Lambert as the early favorite!
Maybe JJ can improve upon its 12-7 record and #228 Lax Power rating next year. Section 1 sure must be tough if that kind of team is getting to the finals.
I personally can’t wait for Lambert to graduate already! Enough of the same hype over and over. He is the greatest, OK. We got it.
Maybe JJ can improve upon its 12-7 record and #228 Lax Power rating next year. Section 1 sure must be tough if that is its 2nd best team!
Funny how BigRed and LaxLessons Fan posted the exact same message. Kind of shady to me. I feel like there’s a Darien PR machine spinning a reply to anyone who dares state their precious Blue Wave did not have such a glorious season and that all their players, let alone Case, should be MVP. Kind of pathetic don’t you think? So too is spouting off meaningless Laxpower computer garbage when John Jay beat Darien in a scrimmage and then took Yorktown to OT in sectional finals. The same Yorktown that beat Darien. Spin that one Big Red/LaxLessons Fan. Facts are stubborn things my friend. Better luck next year.
Darien had a good season, but certainly not a glorious one. Case on the other hand, had an incredible season. It seems unfair that the Darien fans must sit back and approve of comments from section 1 fans talking about scrimmage wins. Yes, Yorktown beat Darien. Darien beat Wilton and St. A’s. Wilton and St. A’s beat Yorktown. And around we go; the season isn’t decided by one game.
Maybe JJ can improve upon its 12-7 record and #228 Lax Power rating next year. Section 1 sure must be a tough conference if this is its 2nd best team.
Wow. How weird is this? Now the third message with the same comment but different name. The Darien spin machine “everyone gets a ribbon” computer reply system must be going haywire and malfunctioning lol.
Just so we don’t get a 5th comment from a different handle name saying the same thing, let’s just agree, shall we? Darien is great and would have won the Division I title over Loyola had it been eligible. Case is better than Paul Rabil and Rob Pannell combined. Is that good? OK, now I definitely WON’T be watching Stepford Wives tonight HAHA!
FCLaxFan,
You make some valid points, I can see where Parnon was voted by his team last yr because Case was POY.
And maybe he should have been this yr also but was not, with that said you might think his teammates would because he didn’t. As for the State Championship being more important I completely agree with you. I have been watching HS Lacrosse for 47 plus yrs, and know many players who have played for Wilton,NC, Darien and others and most have told me they would rather win the F.C.I.A.C than the State. Of the youngmen who have been mentioned here are all outstanding players, and their are many who have not been because NJ is not really involved on this blog…
On to more constructive thoughts. Best of luck to the Tri-State Under Armour All American Seniors who will be playing in Baltimore at the end of the month.
Matheis, Dwyer, Berkery, West, Britton, Duvnyak, Edmonds, Palasek, Marino, Pannell, Forsberg, Doktor, Frocarro, and Linares. Make the Tri-State proud.
Hard to imagine this group losing to anyone!
Sec 1,
Thank you for your thoughts. You always have excelent insights that make these blogs interesting.
Echo that thought on Sec 1.
Case is amazing and has my vote in the tristate!
Slacrosse,
Thanks and Ditto to you.
I think it should be noted that Matheis’ invisible performance tonight in the Under Armour AA game hardly helps his “Case” when it comes to this topic.